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#107560 - 12/30/12 10:21 AM Re: Historical question [Re: Wieslaw]
Mike_H Offline
Feather

Registered: 11/08/11
Posts: 33
Loc: Texas
Dominiques have sex linked barring and are recognized as America’s first chicken breed. In a discussion about the history of Dominiques the American livestock breeds conservancy says that such barred chickens where were somewhat common in the eastern United States as early as 1750. I don't know about European or Asian stocks.

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#107566 - 12/31/12 05:59 AM Re: Historical question [Re: Mike_H]
Henk69 Offline
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Classroom Professor

Registered: 02/13/06
Posts: 3228
Loc: Netherlands
You are looking for the origin of the barring?

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#107572 - 12/31/12 07:00 AM Re: Historical question [Re: Henk69]
Wieslaw Offline
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Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 3824
Loc: Denmark
Hi Henk, it was I who was looking for the earliest mention of the barring. Thanks Mike H!!

Thanks guys for the information about the cochins and their leg feathering. I've made a blunder on the Polish forum by claiming, that they got if from Brahmas, now I will be forced to rectify it.

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#107586 - 12/31/12 07:00 PM Re: Historical question [Re: Wieslaw]
KazJaps Offline
Classroom Professor

Registered: 08/30/02
Posts: 2864
Loc: Australia
Hopefully the DNA testing of B will continue, maybe help with tracing the origins of barred breeds, eg as quoted previously:

The B1 allele was found in breeds /lines like:
-Barred Plymouth Rock,
-broiler lines,
-Coucou de Rennes,
-Coucou du Vercors.

The B2 allele was found in breeds / lines like:
-White Leghorn, commercial
-White Leghorn, line 13
-White Leghorn, Obese strain
-Järhöns

The trouble is that some of these old European breeds (Coucou de Rennes, Coucou du Vercors, Malines, Scots Grey, etc) may have had some Barred Plymouth Rock blood infused into some lines at later stages (when numbers dwindled), eg especially with the Marans. So it is hard to know which came first. It would be interesting to see what B allele Crele OEG have.

I've also read that some earlier d'Anvers were quoted as being coucou (cuckoo), black, & golden (later perfected as Quails) (British published Belgian Bantams book, by Veronica Mayhew, 1999). d'Anver type bantams in Belgium/Netherlands had been known from the early 17th century, & imports of bantams from Malaya Isles & Sundra were known to occur in the later 17th century. So I don't know if the cuckoo came later from S.E. Asia, or were already in Europe.

--------------------------
In PB&G (p 45) there is mention that feather-legged chickens were known by Aldrovandi (by about 1600 A.D).


Edited by KazJaps (12/31/12 07:21 PM)
Edit Reason: added "Netherlands"

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#107696 - 01/09/13 06:57 PM Re: Historical question [Re: Wieslaw]
987654321 Offline
Feather

Registered: 08/15/12
Posts: 36
Loc: Australia
Originally Posted By: Wieslaw
Next historical question. According to some written American sources, the first Cochin chickens imported to US had no leg feathering or a very sparse one. Where did they get their abundant leg feathers from then? What about the English ones?


I have just purchased a book that may help with an accurate description, written in 1855, The History of The Hen Fever by Geo. P. Burnham. One man's personal account of "this extraordinary mania" from his first experience of it in 1849. Chapter 2 is titled "The Cochin-Chinas...Bubble Number One" Chapter 14 is titled "Bother'em Pootrums" (Brahams)...Bubble Number Two" Chapter 20 "Present To Queen Victoria". It lists having numerous drawings so hopefully something accurate might be in there for you?

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#107714 - 01/12/13 05:25 PM Re: Historical question [Re: 987654321]
Wieslaw Offline
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Classroom Professor

Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 3824
Loc: Denmark
987654321, thank you for the information about the book. I will see if it is possible for me to get it.

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#107722 - 01/13/13 01:47 PM Re: Historical question [Re: Wieslaw]
Wieslaw Offline
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Classroom Professor

Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 3824
Loc: Denmark
Next question. I recall an old thread with a link to an external source on history of Laced Wyandottes. I cannot find it. I remember vaguely, that the text said something like that' Sebrights were used in the developement', but I recall it was mentioned as if it was LARGE FOWL! Does it ring any bell with somebody? Or have I mixed everything up?

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#107748 - 01/14/13 02:03 AM Re: Historical question [Re: Wieslaw]
Henk69 Offline
Moderator
Classroom Professor

Registered: 02/13/06
Posts: 3228
Loc: Netherlands
Wasn't that a piece from absent friend Sigi about single laced cochins?

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#107764 - 01/14/13 01:17 PM Re: Historical question [Re: 987654321]
Redcap Offline
Ruler of the Roost

Registered: 08/14/06
Posts: 985
Loc: Germany
Originally Posted By: 987654321
Originally Posted By: Wieslaw
Next historical question. According to some written American sources, the first Cochin chickens imported to US had no leg feathering or a very sparse one. Where did they get their abundant leg feathers from then? What about the English ones?


I have just purchased a book that may help with an accurate description, written in 1855, The History of The Hen Fever by Geo. P. Burnham. One man's personal account of "this extraordinary mania" from his first experience of it in 1849. Chapter 2 is titled "The Cochin-Chinas...Bubble Number One" Chapter 14 is titled "Bother'em Pootrums" (Brahams)...Bubble Number Two" Chapter 20 "Present To Queen Victoria". It lists having numerous drawings so hopefully something accurate might be in there for you?


That's for free

http://archive.org/details/cu31924002972424
_________________________

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#108868 - 03/11/13 11:20 AM Re: Historical question [Re: Redcap]
Wieslaw Offline
Moderator
Classroom Professor

Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 3824
Loc: Denmark
Next question. I'm playing a detective at the moment. I have found an old Polish magazine from 1886, which mentions a chicken breed called "Wancenau". Has anybody ever heard about such a breed? Or is it a distortion of a similar word? The name looks like something from West Europe (Holland? Belgium? Germany?)

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