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#79711 - 09/08/05 07:42 AM CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Anonymous
Unregistered


What are the closest gentic relatives of the PEAFOWL ? What other species has it been crossbred with that produced fertile offspring ? If any of you are involved in inter species cross breeding progams OR HAVE BRED SOME ACCIDENTALLY, contact me privately at seedyseed@hotmail.com . This subject upsets some people . However , if God didn't want different specices to crossbreed mules would not have been mentioned in the bible , and he would have made interspecies crossbreeding impossible which it isn't!
The U.S. GOVERNMENT & THE U.S.D.A. have tried to cross chickens with turkeys and with ring-necked pheasants both failed . there are experiments with zebra x donkey and horse and goverment programs in other countries to support it.
Let others explore their dreams and see what we can do without gene splicing before the gene splicers take over . Those who think outside of the box prevent STAGNATION !
IS THERE A SIGHT THAT WELCOMES AND ALLOWS THIS TYPE OF DISCUSSION LET ME KNOW !!

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#79712 - 09/08/05 02:50 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Sally Offline
Coop Keeper

Registered: 08/15/03
Posts: 686
Loc: Florida
Hi Seedy,
Zebraxhorses are called Zorses if Zebra is the male
If the male is a stallion horse and female is Zebra it is called a Hobra
same with minis and donkeys.
these have been bred and used in Africa for dozens of years.
As to birds and peafowl, guineas and peafowl are cousins and do crossbreed. The main reason you can ship peafowl is because you ship them as guineas, not peafowl IF the postal service tries to cause you grief.
Phesants of any kind can and do cross breed with any kind of chicken. It is thought that a lot od the game chickens morphed out from wild red golden phesants. I have a female phesant running loose in the yard. She wandered in from?? she is a ?? they all look alike LOL.
I have seen no eggs and no action with her and the roos, but, if she ever lays fertile eggs it's because they are half chicken.
Why in heavens name would anyone want to intentionally breed chickens and turkeys?? OMG turkeys in most cases outweigh the chickens by so much it would cause a huge problem in egg genetics.....it just isn't smart......all my opinion...my peafowl and guineas do roam together, but the only action I ever saw was a male guinea in love with a yearling male peacock LOL no love connection there...(thank God)
Sally
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sallyDIABLO

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#79713 - 09/08/05 09:03 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Anonymous
Unregistered


I know PeaCOCk sometimes breed guinea hens and produce offspring. I know someone who has a guineaXSalmon Faverolle pullet. I tried to cross mine this year, but only my yearling peacock bred the guineas and so far nothing. Now I've put my guineas with my chickens(they crouch for everything due to not having a male of their own kind)...

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#79714 - 09/11/05 02:41 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Sally Offline
Coop Keeper

Registered: 08/15/03
Posts: 686
Loc: Florida
Guineas and chickens do not have the ability to cross......I would have to see this morph as it is supposed to be impossible....they are totally different Genus's (species?)
The phesants and chickens can cross tho. The chance of eggs being fertile from a year old peacock is slim. Even very, very fertile birds from both groups, guineas and peafowl, have a very low rate of fertility in their eggs....
Sally
_________________________
sallyDIABLO

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#79715 - 09/11/05 03:06 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Jeep Offline
Coop Keeper

Registered: 04/09/03
Posts: 477
Loc: California
Hey Sally,
Peafowl and guineas will cross, as do guineas and chickens. Check out guinea.com and click on the 'weird stuff' forum. There you will see some photos of crossbreeds.

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#79716 - 09/11/05 03:14 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Jrsygntbrdr1 Offline
Classroom Professor

Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2601
Loc: Arkansas
Guineas and Chickens can produce offspring called "Guins." The offspring are not fertile, however, may lay eggs and the such but will remain sterile throughout their lives.

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#79717 - 09/11/05 05:27 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Rob2 Offline
Classroom Professor

Registered: 03/28/03
Posts: 3068
Loc: Pennsylvania
May lay eggs but remain sterile? Isnt the production of an egg a sign of fertility??

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#79718 - 09/11/05 09:20 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Jrsygntbrdr1 Offline
Classroom Professor

Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2601
Loc: Arkansas
Not if it can't be fertilized. It's the same thing with humans. A male may produce sperm, but the sperm may not be formed correctly. A female may produce eggs, but the eggs will not or cannot be fertilized.

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#79719 - 09/12/05 06:57 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Sally Offline
Coop Keeper

Registered: 08/15/03
Posts: 686
Loc: Florida
is there any research to substantiate this theory? proven progeny between these 2 species?
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sallyDIABLO

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#79720 - 09/12/05 09:37 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Jrsygntbrdr1 Offline
Classroom Professor

Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2601
Loc: Arkansas
You mean proof that a guinea and a chicken can cross? Yes, just look up Guin or Chicken X Guinea..or any chicken and guinea cross on Google! It's amazing. There are also plenty of pictures to go around.

http://www.guineafowl.com/fritsfarm/guineas/GuinHen/

http://www.feathersite.com/Poultry/Guineas/BRKGuinHybrid.html

These two sites actually show the guins and it appears that they have even successfully crossed a Peacock and a guinea. However, the offspring will most likely be sterile also since they are of the same genus.

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#79721 - 09/13/05 08:21 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Sally Offline
Coop Keeper

Registered: 08/15/03
Posts: 686
Loc: Florida
I'm not totally convinced that all the pics at feathersite, especially the turkins, are crosses. I have many turkins that look like those chicks of all the different colors of my guineas and chickens. I'm not saying they aren't genuine, I don't need any hate mail, I just think the resemblance is pretty close. Why would you want to cross them if not able to breed them? for the freak factor? is the meat better> the eggs? my guineas are so rude to the chickens, I can't imagine putting them through the grief (not to mention AI breeding to even TRY to get fertile eggs....sheesh, why bother.
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sallyDIABLO

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#79722 - 09/13/05 09:00 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Maybe I can find the pic from ym friend who has a Salmon faverolleXGuinea. That bird looks so weird. She didn't know what to think when this bird hatched out of a guinea egg, looked like a guinea exept for the feathered legs. Now it is milliefleur colored cool looking bird.
My guineas get along with my big chickens fine, I've seen my young peacock and my rooster breed them. I haven't tried to incubate them yet though.

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#79723 - 09/13/05 09:36 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Jrsygntbrdr1 Offline
Classroom Professor

Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2601
Loc: Arkansas
Most of the time it is an accidental crossing. Some people breed them because they want better foragers in their yard, but better egg layers than Guineas. I personally cannot stand guineas and now only deal with chickens and geese. I recall someone posting that guinea meat was very delicious and it makes sense that a meat bird crossed with a guinea would make suitable food.

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#79724 - 09/14/05 06:12 AM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Anonymous
Unregistered


Guineas are yummy, thats soooo true!
Ok, here is a pic of a Salmon Fav. Guin chick:

and here it is 1 yr later:

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#79725 - 09/14/05 11:14 AM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Jrsygntbrdr1 Offline
Classroom Professor

Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2601
Loc: Arkansas
It's sort of cute too!!!! The pretty colors and just look at that face!!!

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#79726 - 09/14/05 02:31 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Jeep Offline
Coop Keeper

Registered: 04/09/03
Posts: 477
Loc: California
jrsygntbrdr1,
I heard somewhere in conversation, maybe here in some ancient post that often times, what you think you are getting when you order pheasant in a restaurant, really isn't pheasant, but guineafowl. I don't eat my guineas, and have never eaten pheasant in a restaurant (or at home), so I couldn't tell you if this is true.

Boothcreek Poultry, what a cute picture!! laugh

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#79727 - 09/14/05 05:10 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Jrsygntbrdr1 Offline
Classroom Professor

Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2601
Loc: Arkansas
I've never ordered pheasant. I don't really trust the way restaurants cook their poultry, so I only order beef products at restaurants...but if anyone has eaten pheasant...was it good? I don't know...I've heard that both pheasant and guinea fowl are good to eat. Either way, you should get what you pay for in a restaurant that offers pheasant as a meal.

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#79728 - 09/14/05 07:25 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Sally Offline
Coop Keeper

Registered: 08/15/03
Posts: 686
Loc: Florida
guineas are all dark meat. I will never NOT have guineas as there was a time when I was so infested with ticks on our property during certain seasons I could have burned the house down, LITERALLY!!
By one year later, with a couple dozen guineas running free and for 3 or 4 years now, I have been virtually tick free!!! They are worth any and ALL the noise they may squawk!! LOL
As to the cross breeding, I will watch mine closer for awhile, but, I have NEVER seen my chickens and guineas cross breed. IF they try they fight each other within an inch of their lives. I HAVE seen the roosters tackle the ducks, but, that is all.
Sally
BTW, the hen is very pretty, but, I am still skeptical, it would make sense to get a hardier chicken or a meatier bird that has white and dark meat and bigger eggs....I don't know.
It's not nice to fool with Mother Nature wink
_________________________
sallyDIABLO

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#79729 - 09/14/05 09:41 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Anonymous
Unregistered


We've never had any ticks, but lots of grasshoppers. My guineas are incredibly noisy, people who had guineas for years say mine are unusally loud. I already had to sell most of my guineas cause my mom would go outside at 5 in the morning with the rifle and shoot at them cause they were so loud(and always at my moms window). The guinea I've eaten was one that died braking its neck while getting chased by its sisters, I found just when it flew against the fence and just twiched. I though I make the best of it. It was very tasty.

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#79730 - 09/14/05 09:43 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Anonymous
Unregistered


BTW, my friend didn't even force her guineas to breed with the salmon faverolles. Her guineas free range and her SFs get to go out in the afternoon, it must have happened then.

My peacock is crazy though, he is on the guineas 24/7. Although I don't think he has that much success.

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#79731 - 09/20/05 06:36 AM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Sally Offline
Coop Keeper

Registered: 08/15/03
Posts: 686
Loc: Florida
It can only be because there are no male guineas and few or only 1 or 2 females, cause MY guineas RULE the yard!! EVERYTHING gets out of their way!! even the dogs LOL. I have 1 junior peahen in with a bunch of bantams. She got in there on her own, by accident, so I just left her there for safety. Well, I can pitch 6 hens in the pen and that guinea hen and she will stand in the middle of the pen, not looked at twice, and the roos chase the hens around and breed them for an hour....I have NEVER seen anything get a jump on the guineas, except the guineas LOL. The pics were pretty though of the SF crosses.
Sally
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sallyDIABLO

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#79732 - 09/22/05 05:13 AM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Sue NH Offline
Coop Cleaner

Registered: 11/15/04
Posts: 182
Loc: New Hampshire
I've got a male guinea that is in love with one of my white leghorns. She isn't all that enamored with him.
Maybe if the romance keeps up come spring I might throw an egg or two under one of the cochins just out of curiosity.

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#79733 - 09/22/05 05:51 AM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Sally Offline
Coop Keeper

Registered: 08/15/03
Posts: 686
Loc: Florida
HAHAHAHAHA now Sue, that is a hoot. they will end up (perhaps) eek skinny legged, louder mouthed, more sour attitude and possibly looking like a domonique something something with a helmet!! hahahahaha OMG take pics!! laugh
sally
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sallyDIABLO

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#79734 - 09/23/05 10:17 AM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Anonymous
Unregistered


I heard in an old post that someone crossed a peacock with a chicken and posted the picture . does anyone know where I can find this picture .
also guineas are known for their hardiness if they were crossed with chickens they could make a more resiliant chicken hybrid strain with a higher egg producing capacity than guineas have. (maybe they will have speckled feathers also )
thank you for your kind and serious replies . anyone interested in contacting me can do so directly . my email address is seedyseed@hotmail.com

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#79735 - 09/23/05 12:11 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Jrsygntbrdr1 Offline
Classroom Professor

Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2601
Loc: Arkansas
the postings are on the first page of this topic. Look for my third posting and the second link will show you the mix of peacock and chicken. Scroll down to the bottom of the website and the pictures will be there.

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#79736 - 09/24/05 01:08 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Sally Offline
Coop Keeper

Registered: 08/15/03
Posts: 686
Loc: Florida
that pic is supposed to be a guinea and chicken, the question was about a chicken and peacock. I don't believe this is possible even IF the guinea and chicken is related. Perhaps by AI or test tube breeding, but, WHY?
Sally
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sallyDIABLO

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#79737 - 09/25/05 05:50 AM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Sue NH Offline
Coop Cleaner

Registered: 11/15/04
Posts: 182
Loc: New Hampshire
The pictures of the cross species I've seen are UGLY! Looks like they inherit the the worst from each parent.
I have to admit my leghorns are my least favorite bird. My kid was bugging me for a white chicken and I made the mistake of stopping in a feed store that had some. Not nervous but just not my friend like the other assorted brown egg layers are.
Fred...Fred the guinea cock is the underdog of the flock. His mate was eaten by a fox and other guineas who had all paired up drove him away to live with the chickens. I feel sorry for Fred. Hopefully with my flock of teen guineas there will be another guinea lady for him next spring. The leghorn hen just doesn't appreciate his style or rather complete lack of it.
If the two mismatches are still an item come spring I'll hatch a few. Nothing to loose. Probably get good money for a weird cross at the nearby auction.
If anybody is nearby with an incubator your welcome to a few of the leghorns eggs now. Right now the only mature rooster I have is a bantam cochin and he can't reach. Not that I'd underestimate a determined bantam rooster but there does seem to be too great a size difference for him to be the dad. Fred does manage to catch that roadrunner hen.

On an interesting side note, I do have one other white leghorn hen. Fred does not care for her nearly as much as the one. The one he likes I honestly thought was a roo for a long time. She had a very large and very red comb early on. Much more so than the other. The other has a big leghorn comb but definately a size difference in the red flesh. Maybe something about that oversized comb Fred finds sexy? He pays no mind to my other hens, assorted rocks, wyandottes and sexlinks. He likes those big combs.

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#79738 - 09/25/05 02:51 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Jrsygntbrdr1 Offline
Classroom Professor

Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2601
Loc: Arkansas
Some people like to be able to test different theories. Maybe they want the peacock colors/feathers on birds that will lay more eggs for consumption. I believe the peacock/chicken breeding could be successful in a controlled enviornment especially with AI. You will probably have to do a search on google for Chicken/Peacock cross or something. good luck!

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#79739 - 10/03/05 05:35 AM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Sally Offline
Coop Keeper

Registered: 08/15/03
Posts: 686
Loc: Florida
I have a blue pied guinea hen pullet that INSISTS on being in the pen with the stizzles. We are at pre-butcher stages right now so there are 15 roos in there. I have NEVER seen them look at her twice, but, they'll chase each other around until their half naked of feathers......weird
time will tell I guess. next year probably
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sallyDIABLO

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#79740 - 10/24/05 09:21 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Anonymous
Unregistered


On Disney Channel they are promoting the forth-coming premier of the computer animated "Chicken Little" by giving "chicken facts". One "fact" they give is that a "cross between a chicken and a turkey is called a 'turken'". It bothers me when facts that can be checked as simply a a Google search or a quick glimpse at the McMurray website are still given incorrectly. Bah.

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#79741 - 10/26/05 09:11 AM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Seedy Seeds Offline
Coop Cleaner

Registered: 08/29/05
Posts: 240
Loc: Massachusetts
The turken has yet to be achieved, those advertized are just "naked neck chickens" !
I have heard of a turkey guinea fowl cross (these could be a superior meat bird )and a turkey pheasant cross . Which is the closer relative of the turkey? Does any one have a picture? also is there a peafowl X turkey cross amongst our members ? confused

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#79742 - 11/06/05 11:23 AM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
KS Waterfowl Offline
Chicken

Registered: 02/19/05
Posts: 106
Loc: Indiana
Just wanted to try to clear it up a little here. Guineas x Chicken, Guineas x Peafowl, Pheasants x Chickens all work. The eggs that are the result of these crosses will (if fertile) hatch crosses between the two. A chicken or bird will lay an egg no regaurdless if there is a rooster around to fertilize the egg. There are laying farms that have hundreds of hens but no roosters, and those are the same eggs you get at the store. And finally Turkens (Naked Necks) are not Turkey x Chicken crosses!!! The Disney Channel, stated in a "Chicken Little" promo commercial, that the common name for a chicken/turkey cross is a turken, but not so! The Turken is purely chicken bred in Europe not to have feathered necks. The trait is dominate, so you can breed a turken to any other breed of chiken and get other naked neck chicks. Hope that clears things a little

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#79743 - 11/06/05 09:26 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Jrsygntbrdr1 Offline
Classroom Professor

Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2601
Loc: Arkansas
Well, of course hens will lay eggs without a rooster! lol! Most people know that...except for my cousin who is 32 that though eggs from the store were made at the store and weren't "chicken butt eggs!" HAHAHAH!!!! That was a riot!

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#79744 - 12/08/05 07:23 AM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Seedy Seeds Offline
Coop Cleaner

Registered: 08/29/05
Posts: 240
Loc: Massachusetts
I see that the turkey can cross with the peafowl and the guinea (they say guinea tastes better than turkey so this could develop into a superior meat bird with the turkey size and the guineas taste), Thus even if it is sterile :rolleyes: it would have value . and the peafowl X turkey could combine ornamental and the largest heaviest poultry breed . a dual purpose bird . the peafowl has been crossed with the chicken by the way . A picture was once posted on this web sight . but I can not find it. can anyone find it for me ? eek some say a pheasant X turkey cross may be fertile . Any fertile extra-species hybrids interest me . For a limited time I have the book "Bird Hybrids " by A.P. Gray . any one want anything checked? confused just ask! laugh
"

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#79745 - 12/08/05 12:11 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Jrsygntbrdr1 Offline
Classroom Professor

Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2601
Loc: Arkansas
It was a Guinea X Peacock cross. I posted it on the first thing, but I was corrected and it was a Guinea X Peacock cross. There are also pictures of other crosses. Especially the Salmon Faverolle cross! That one is still adorable in my book!

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#79746 - 12/08/05 01:51 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Seedy Seeds Offline
Coop Cleaner

Registered: 08/29/05
Posts: 240
Loc: Massachusetts
thank you for the posting ! I was refering to another posting ,which was years ago. according to A.greys book"Bird Hybrids" these other crosses are possible . laugh

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#79747 - 12/27/05 02:21 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Glenda L. Heywood Offline
Chicken

Registered: 12/12/05
Posts: 101
Loc: South Dakota
well here is my learning and experience
yes pheasants do bross bred with chickens
BUT the only way to get fertile chicks is the hen is chicken and the male is a regular common pheasant. Not the exotic kind
Know a lady who had them many yrs and hatched their eggs.
Now for a guinea I believe it will only be mules that hatch out
never being fertile
Some mules lay eggs but do not become fertile

Just a Muscovy ducks can mate to chickens but the only way to be fertile in offspring is by
muscovy hen mates with a pekin duck
as the female controls the length of hatching and a muscovy is 35 days not like pekin ducks.
The other way around they ar mules.
Glenda L heywood
frizzlebird6@yahoo.com
http://www.gkpet.com
click on pet forum & discussion for articles
http://www.nationalpoultrynews.com
_________________________
Glenda L. Heywood

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#79748 - 01/12/06 11:52 AM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Seedy Seeds Offline
Coop Cleaner

Registered: 08/29/05
Posts: 240
Loc: Massachusetts
Thank you SO much for showing us all how to overecome the " mule factor " in muscovies .
You have been the first to tell us how . this is exactly the kind of information I am looking for! laugh

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#79749 - 01/12/06 12:16 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Jocelyn Offline
Lord of the Fowl

Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 1467
Loc: Canada
Muscovies are fertile both ways, just that the hybrids must be backcrossed as they are not fertile interse. Muscovie of either sex times pekin of opposite sex will make the hybrids....but they must be mated muscovie or pekin...not to another hybrid. It is common here to do that and backcross pekin till the facial caruncles are gone and type is recovered...to make bigger pekins for the show cage.

I've hatched some for my customers, and don't see any reason for them to tell me the wrong parentage.

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#79750 - 01/31/06 05:21 PM Re: CLOSEST GENETIC RELATIVES OF PEAFOWL?
Seedy Seeds Offline
Coop Cleaner

Registered: 08/29/05
Posts: 240
Loc: Massachusetts
smile thank you for straitenig us out !you are the first person to tell me thar muscovy hybrids can be used in further breeding . laugh

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