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#83120 - 03/30/07 03:49 PM Re: Any idea why?
Joachim Dippold Offline
Lord of the Fowl

Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 1823
Loc: Austria
Hello Jean,

Yep, I think both, either S/s and/or Ap, can lead to a "not clean" silver. I think this "Roodgechouderd" is the common name for "Ap", in German there are Dark Brahmas carrying Ap (and some also Bl) and they are called "mit Orangerücken", a horrible term meaning "orangeback". LOL! Rotgeschultert/Redshouldered would sound better to me, eitheway this is cool;-) I think "Roodgechouderd Zilverpatrijs" means just the same, Zilverpatrijs = Silverpartridge = Dark and there you are: "Silberwildfarbig mit Orangerücken" = "Dark with orangeback". Germans... LOL!

I hope you will enjoy the surprises, makes it all more, c'est le truc, "interesting", right?

Best greetings,

Joachim

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#83121 - 03/30/07 05:35 PM Re: Any idea why?
CJR Offline
Coop Master

Registered: 07/16/02
Posts: 8490
Loc: Montana
Reeders book explained the
Ap in Silvers (Zilverpatrijs). Gankema just called it an "attachment". I don't know if he was keeping his book really simple--or, at the time he published the book, had not learned about Ap as a gene (when "attached" to Silver, it ruins the Black and White bird unacceptably, by "attaching" rust or color to the back or wing bows of the males) It is almost impossible to breed out, once introduced. If you raise Silvers for Show-- NEVER breed Light Brown and Silver--not even once! CJR

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#83122 - 03/30/07 07:36 PM Re: Any idea why?
Kristi Offline
Chicken

Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 101
Loc: California
All this genetics is too much for me! But, Cara, I agree that the BCLB and BLB females are very unpredictable when they moult. I had several that were good color as pullets and then more blue feathering then the tan feathering (with blue peppering) they had as pullets
_________________________
KvG

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#83123 - 03/30/07 07:47 PM Re: Any idea why?
Anonymous
Unregistered


My little rooster has just the same coloring and markings as your picture Smoky. He is just 6 months old.

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#83124 - 03/31/07 12:55 AM Re: Any idea why?
Joachim Dippold Offline
Lord of the Fowl

Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 1823
Loc: Austria
Hello Jean,

You siad itīs almost impossible to breed out, interesting. I wonder why? Maybe because it shows relativly late in feathering and therefore many breeders donīt see in their chicks when selecting? Maybe because it mimiks S/s (impure silver, split for silver) and therefore is difficult to differentiate? Eitherway I think Ap makes for many "weird" colors that would not be possible without it.

Gotty run, best greetings,

Joachim

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#83125 - 03/31/07 04:21 AM Re: Any idea why?
L. Haggarty Offline
Coop Keeper

Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 440
Loc: Kentucky
I'm fascinated by all the genetics, and envious of your ability Jean to tease out all these wonderful colors. Please keep at it! We need such expertise and experimenting.
_________________________
Laura Haggarty
www.pathfindersfarm.com

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#83126 - 03/31/07 08:36 AM Re: Any idea why?
CJR Offline
Coop Master

Registered: 07/16/02
Posts: 8490
Loc: Montana
Joachim, This is doubtless why Dr. Gankema did not name the gene, but called it an "attachment". Perhaps it does not behave that way with other than Silver, but I suspect it does. Jeffrey (American Old English Game Bantams), had not discovered some of the genes and gene influence, but gave us a great foundation. Has the location of the Ap gene been posted? CJR

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#83127 - 03/31/07 03:54 PM Re: Any idea why?
Joachim Dippold Offline
Lord of the Fowl

Registered: 02/28/06
Posts: 1823
Loc: Austria
Hello Jean,

I donīt know if the location of the Ap gene has been found out. There are threads about the location of certain genes every now and then, even though I donīt understand them I read them. But I canīt remember more than that Dr. Ron has something to do with those "things" and several other experts are involved, also. Canīt recal more details, I have a very bad memory, sorry;-)

Best greetings,

Joachim

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#83128 - 03/31/07 06:18 PM Re: Any idea why?
Smoky73 Offline
Coop Keeper

Registered: 01/14/05
Posts: 697
Loc: Colorado
I keep all the BCLB pullets even though they look like that. I try to ignore the fact they look weird just because I know the genetics of them, they come from good lines. I just won't be showing them anymore. But, they make awesome babies!!!
_________________________
Cara Smith
http://www.silverpulletpoultry.net

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#83129 - 03/31/07 08:41 PM Re: Any idea why?
CJR Offline
Coop Master

Registered: 07/16/02
Posts: 8490
Loc: Montana
If they are good type, it is the best, to keep them, as bred to good CLB males, they have a chance of producing GOOD BCLB males and females. Just having a female the right color at Show time is always questionable. When one comes along and holds the right tan with blue peppering there may be some genetic success that I do not understand (and I don't think any geneticist does, either--YET--) and it doesn't bother me!

Did the BCLB pullet, now hen, ever produce for you Cara? I have never hatched from her BCLB Splash sister. She has never been a particularly good layer, but is laying now, mated with my really nice Splash cock--and I hope to set some eggs to hatch after the Great Falls Show. She is very "white" with almost no spots, small, pale salmon breast, and the cock is mostly white, also, nice red back. Several people want some, and I need another female in the Schuurman line (my 11 year old BCLB Splash hen--mother of your BCLB and my Splash hen). Old 29R may not be with me too much longer, laid several soft shelled eggs earlier, but looks spry and active. If one breaks inside--that will be her end! CJR

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