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#90417 - 07/15/10 02:30 PM Black Tailed Buff/Red to Chocolate Tailed Buff/Red
KS Waterfowl Offline
Chicken

Registered: 02/19/05
Posts: 104
Loc: Indiana
I have been working on a couple of crosses with some of our various breeds of chickens. My one hen was chocolate. (She was an OEGB) anyway, I crossed her over a Nankin rooster and got these chicks that are both chocolate with buff, but the chocolate is like a base color, or primary color and then the buff pattern looks like it lays over the chocolate. My original intent was to change the black in the tails and wings to chocolate. I have both a cockerel and a pullet from the original cross and they look similar (the cockerel having the male plumage though) I thought there was a thread on here some place similar to what I was doing, but can't locate it. I was trying to decide in order to get closer to my goal, do I breed these two back together, or do I cross the hen back to the father in order to get birds that are more similar to the Nankin, but having chocolate tails and wing areas instead of black like the Nankin. I am keeping the Nankins pure, but the chocolate OE hen was put in the community pen when it was cold, and when we tested the incubator, these hatched, and I've been trying to figure out how to make chocolate tailed reds (as in Nankins) as opposed to black tailed reds.



The two birds in the center are the parent birds, I will have to get pictures of the two chicks in question, they are about 2 months old now. I am also playing with combs on the Nankins in breeding pens, I have basically, rose comb, single comb, the high rosecombs which are part rose comb and one that looks almost like a buttercup comb, but its a messed up rose comb. But out of the chicks I've hatched so far I have a nice even mix of what looks like they will be nicely shaped rose combs and nice single combs...but we will see how the grow up. The two chicks the male is Single and the hen is rose I believe, I will have to double check, but I am not worried about their combs, just interested in producing the color.
THANKS,
KS

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#90418 - 07/15/10 02:40 PM Re: Black Tailed Buff/Red to Chocolate Tailed Buff/Red [Re: KS Waterfowl]
Marvin Online   content
Lord of the Fowl

Registered: 11/23/06
Posts: 1888
Loc: Nicaragua
Originally Posted By: KS Waterfowl
I've been trying to figure out how to make chocolate tailed reds (as in Nankins) as opposed to black tailed reds.


well your OEG carries the Semi dominant dunn gene that in a sigle dose will change black to chocolate but in 2 doses will change it to a blue type... cross a hen from that batch back to nankins and keep breeding get back to the nankins and you will get the birds you want, BUT only half of them will have chocolate tails.. wink

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#90419 - 07/15/10 02:50 PM Re: Black Tailed Buff/Red to Chocolate Tailed Buff/Red [Re: KS Waterfowl]
Marvin Online   content
Lord of the Fowl

Registered: 11/23/06
Posts: 1888
Loc: Nicaragua

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#90420 - 07/15/10 03:09 PM Re: Black Tailed Buff/Red to Chocolate Tailed Buff/Red [Re: Marvin]
KS Waterfowl Offline
Chicken

Registered: 02/19/05
Posts: 104
Loc: Indiana
I am not trying to mess up the Nankins. It has taken me far too long to get them and actually start breeding them. I have 3 males and 6 females currently. But I just wanted to see what chicks from that spare hen would look like when crossed with. I am going to keep the chicks around to see what future generations look like, but I was hoping to see the end product turn out chocolate tailed buff. THANKS for the info. (one nankin male is normally the odd fellow out, so I will put him with the female when she gets old and hatch a few eggs off if she survives long enough.)


Edited by KS Waterfowl (07/15/10 03:11 PM)

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#90421 - 07/15/10 03:32 PM Re: Black Tailed Buff/Red to Chocolate Tailed Buff/Red [Re: KS Waterfowl]
Marvin Online   content
Lord of the Fowl

Registered: 11/23/06
Posts: 1888
Loc: Nicaragua
Originally Posted By: KS Waterfowl
I am not trying to mess up the Nankins.
you will NOT as most OEG genes are recesives and since you will be doing back crossing at least 3 times those genes will be left behind.. wink

Originally Posted By: KS Waterfowl

I just wanted to see what chicks from that spare hen would look like
they will look buff as the genes of buffs birds are mostly dominant....but only 50% of the chicks will be chocolate tailed... cool

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#90422 - 07/15/10 04:07 PM Re: Black Tailed Buff/Red to Chocolate Tailed Buff/Red [Re: Marvin]
Marvin Online   content
Lord of the Fowl

Registered: 11/23/06
Posts: 1888
Loc: Nicaragua
buddy here is a link where you can lear more about Dunn chocolate.... http://kippenjungle.nl/bruinzilverpatrijs.htm here you will see pics of chocolate tail white(its buff but on a silver background)


Edited by Marvin (07/15/10 04:10 PM)

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#90457 - 07/17/10 12:15 PM Re: Black Tailed Buff/Red to Chocolate Tailed Buff/Red [Re: Marvin]
KS Waterfowl Offline
Chicken

Registered: 02/19/05
Posts: 104
Loc: Indiana
Here are my f1's. Thanks for the info Marvin, it has been very helpful with picturing what I am thinking.










The same cockerel as above but a slightly different view.



Edited by KS Waterfowl (07/17/10 12:16 PM)

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#90501 - 07/19/10 09:24 AM Re: Black Tailed Buff/Red to Chocolate Tailed Buff/Red [Re: KS Waterfowl]
Marvin Online   content
Lord of the Fowl

Registered: 11/23/06
Posts: 1888
Loc: Nicaragua
Originally Posted By: KS Waterfowl
Here are my f1's.

The same cockerel as above but a slightly different view.


WOW...Talk about Chocolate... laugh that usa the male on your best hen, then use his son back to another good hen.... wink

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#90614 - 07/26/10 02:27 PM Re: Black Tailed Buff/Red to Chocolate Tailed Buff/Red [Re: Marvin]
KS Waterfowl Offline
Chicken

Registered: 02/19/05
Posts: 104
Loc: Indiana
Are you suggesting I set up two breeding pens and use the f1 back with her Nankin father and I should cross the f1 cockerel back with a Nankin female. Sort of a double cross...I gave away the original parent chocolate female to a 4-Her, but she's just up the road so if I needed to borrow her back to cross with the f1 cockerel, I am sure I could probably convince said 4-Her. smile I am hoping to get a late season hatch of Nankins, and if the cockerel starts breeding, I may see if I can't hatch some from him and a Nankin hen late LATE season.
K&S


Edited by KS Waterfowl (07/26/10 02:27 PM)

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#90616 - 07/26/10 03:54 PM Re: Black Tailed Buff/Red to Chocolate Tailed Buff/Red [Re: KS Waterfowl]
Marvin Online   content
Lord of the Fowl

Registered: 11/23/06
Posts: 1888
Loc: Nicaragua
Originally Posted By: KS Waterfowl
Are you suggesting I set up two breeding pens and use the f1 back with her Nankin father and I should cross the f1 cockerel back with a Nankin female.
No...Just use that good male, use him back to a good nankin female,that will give you B1 chicks that are 3/4 nankins, out of that batch use the Best male again,...there no need anymore for the original dunn hen as this cockerel has it, he wont be of any use if you hatch enuff males with Dunn in the Back cross:B1 if you think this boy looks good, just wait to see his sons... wink


Edited by Marvin (07/26/10 03:54 PM)

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