Page 1 of 2 1 2 >
Topic Options
#98252 - 08/10/11 11:38 AM Pipping at wrong end - causes?
ssc Offline
Chicken

Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 83
Loc: uk
Hello All (first post)
If a chick pips at the wrong end (eggs stored point down less than 7 days then incubated on sides in Brinsea Ova Easy) is this faulty handling/incubating techniques, or likely to be a genetic fault which may perpetuate if the bird is added to the breeding pen.
Many thanks

Top
#98259 - 08/10/11 04:13 PM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: ssc]
Wieslaw Offline
Moderator
Classroom Professor

Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 3769
Loc: Denmark
Welcome to the coop. I do not know if it is genetic(it would be difficult to remember and follow the trait), and what the cause might be. But I had several this spring and they all hatched without problems. So I do not think you should be worried about it. And if they would die, the trait would not be passed on, so the problem would be solved by itself.
While candling the eggs I have observed that some eggs have their air chamber on a side of the egg instead of at the top. But I do not remember if it had a bad influence on hatching.

Top
#98263 - 08/11/11 01:27 AM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: Wieslaw]
ssc Offline
Chicken

Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 83
Loc: uk
Thanks for that - food for thought, and of course as you say, if it is a problem is resolves itself naturally.

Top
#98265 - 08/11/11 06:11 AM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: ssc]
Richard in MA Offline
Flock Leader

Registered: 01/23/07
Posts: 332
Loc: Massachusetts
I normally incubate my eggs in an auto turner that holds them upright (air space up) and have never had a chick pip at the wrong end. A couple times I set some eggs (same type) horizontally and hand turned and had a few pip at the wrong end. Those hatched without a problem as well but I think it is probably more related to egg position than anything.

Top
#98267 - 08/11/11 09:10 AM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: Richard in MA]
ssc Offline
Chicken

Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 83
Loc: uk
Thanks for that Richard, I might try and see if I can get some trays to hold them upright in the Ova-Easy. Love the colours of the eggs in you Avatar smile

Top
#98290 - 08/13/11 03:35 PM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: ssc]
Uno Offline
Lord of the Fowl

Registered: 08/26/05
Posts: 1280
Loc: Canada
I hatch with the eggs laying on their side, like they do in a nest and I turn them by hand. Supposed to be three times a day, but sometimes only once every 24 hours (lazy!)

I get some that hatch the regular way, some that hatch the irregular way. As long as they don't find slime or water in the egg, they can often make it. I do not know what cuases the position problems.

Wiselaw, air sacs belong in the fat end of the egg. If they show up anywhere else, there is a problem. WHen I have eggs sent to me in the mail / bus / airplane, the air sacs are usually collapsed or knocked out of position. These eggs have a lower hatch rate, but I set them anyway. I usually prop them fat end up in little paper collars and rotate them, but not lay them on their side and turn them. SOme still make it. BUt an airsac should be at the fat end.

Top
#98291 - 08/13/11 04:46 PM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: Uno]
Wieslaw Offline
Moderator
Classroom Professor

Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 3769
Loc: Denmark
Yes, I know the air sacs belong to the fat end , but they are not always aware of this.

Top
#98303 - 08/14/11 08:15 AM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: Wieslaw]
Uno Offline
Lord of the Fowl

Registered: 08/26/05
Posts: 1280
Loc: Canada
Those pesky air sacs! I hate it when they go wandering around! WHy can't they just stay where they belong?

Wieslaw, do you find the air sacs are displaced in fresh eggs from your own hens? OR does this happen to eggs someone sent you for hatching? I have never had a 'moved' air sac if the eggs are fresh from my own hens. Shipping eggs really seems to mess them up though. I would be very curious to find out WHY the air sacs are off centre, if this is happening in fresh eggs from your own birds.

Top
#98350 - 08/16/11 06:05 PM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: Uno]
Wieslaw Offline
Moderator
Classroom Professor

Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 3769
Loc: Denmark
Hi Uno, yes, but very rarely. I don't know the reason why.

Top
#98361 - 08/17/11 09:48 AM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: Wieslaw]
Wieslaw Offline
Moderator
Classroom Professor

Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 3769
Loc: Denmark
I have a correction to my previous posting. My wife has boiled some eggs from my youngsters.Here is a selection



She said that it actually happens often and was very suprised that it is 'not normal'.

Top
#98367 - 08/17/11 03:52 PM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: Wieslaw]
CJR Online   content
Coop Master

Registered: 07/16/02
Posts: 8489
Loc: Montana
Same as human "breech" babies?? The embryo should orient with head, so that the beak will do its work into the air sac. This may mean that any lively embryo may not make that turn position in time for the birth/hatch. All embryos, human as well as calves, foals, etc. for reasons we do not know, and this includes avians, may not make that correct move at the proper time. This can make live birth/hatch more risky, if not a "fast" birth/hatch. Lots of breech calves are "pulled" and if done promptly and correctly, survive just fine. Still birth/hatch may result if there is no help, but not always. I have helped a breech chick--candling can give you the orientation, if you have small hen-hatches and one seems delayed. Some need no help. Some, instead of opening the fat end of the egg, may chip around the middle! Grateful that most hatch "normally". CJR

Anyone check with the phase of the moon at the time? No, I don't, but there will be someone who will give that as the reason for the delay in embryo orientation for hatch--or other such "abnormal" happenings. (where are the smileys?)

Top
#98916 - 09/11/11 04:35 AM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: CJR]
ReniesPeeps Offline
New Egg

Registered: 09/08/11
Posts: 5
Loc: NH
I have this problem with what I call bullet shaped eggs. All hatching eggs here are collected 4 to 5 times a day to insure cleanliness and put right into a clean egg carton point side down. Yes the carton positions are moved through out the day simulating their mother. I was still having problems with the bullet eggs hatching from the bottom... Then I tried laying them on their sides during lock down. Bingo... they are hatching on their own and doing alot better.
_________________________
Renie's Peeps
"Where Orpingtons Reign Supreme"
United Orpington Club Member
NPIP inspected
Renie

Top
#99009 - 09/14/11 11:10 PM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: ReniesPeeps]
nzchicke Offline
Chicken

Registered: 12/24/10
Posts: 75
Loc: South Island NZ
My opinion is that it is because the eggs are lying down for the incubation period. Google it and it comes up alot, most on emu eggs as it has been thoroughly tested in them that it is up to 40% hatch wrong when eggs are incubated lying down(for first 10days I think from memory)rather than Point down. chickens eggs are supposibly meant to not be as greatly affected as the emus by this. I got a new incubator and it is a eggs-lying-down one and the first hatch I had 1/3 of who hatched, (only 50%) hatched backwards. compared with my rcom which was standing up eggs, only 1/50 I ever noticed hatched backwards.
It also varies between incubators as to the exact angle and between eggs, good eggs of classic egg shape will more likely hatch right lying down than the preciously stated 'bullet shaped' egg as it will lie much 'flatter' with less tilt.

smile hope that helps

Top
#99062 - 09/17/11 05:21 PM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: nzchicke]
Wieslaw Offline
Moderator
Classroom Professor

Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 3769
Loc: Denmark
I just want to remind that in nature all the eggs are lying and not standing while incubated. It would be very difficult for a bird to sit on standing eggs, ispecially for an emu.

Top
#108688 - 02/26/13 10:17 PM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: Wieslaw]
Murray Offline
Chick

Registered: 01/18/13
Posts: 13
Loc: Western Australia
But they aren't dead flat either like in incubator floors the nests are domed shape and the points do face down a little but not upright as in some incubators.

Top
#108718 - 02/28/13 09:28 PM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: Murray]
Fowled Out Offline
Coop Cleaner

Registered: 06/11/07
Posts: 227
Loc: Arkansas
Originally Posted By: Murray
But they aren't dead flat either like in incubator floors the nests are domed shape and the points do face down a little but not upright as in some incubators.


Yep. I think that is why hens dig like crazy when trying to make their nest. Those darn nest boxes just don't cooperate.


Anyway, I came to this thread to see if anyone who uses an egg turner during incubation also uses paper trays or cartons to keep their eggs point down during the last three days or lockdown? I was wondering if their hatch rate is better leaving the eggs upright or if they hatch better lying down?

Top
#108728 - 03/01/13 06:29 AM Re: Pipping at wrong end - causes? [Re: Fowled Out]
Murray Offline
Chick

Registered: 01/18/13
Posts: 13
Loc: Western Australia
I only have done one hatch with the eggs in egg cartons and they hatched just as good and a lot less mess to clean . I don't think it has a great effect either way.

Top
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >


Moderator:  Admin @ The Coop, Moderator2